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Author
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Topic: gooseneck on # 1162
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whited
unregistered
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posted September 16, 2005 11:07 AM
 
Here's my boom gooseneck.
A couple of the pictures were blurry & I deleted. (darn autofocus)!
1/ sailing position ...see how square portion of gooseneck shaft fully inserted onto boom at tack end.
 2/ furling position..note how gooseneck shaft is retracted from tack end of boom and remaining portion of shaft is rounded.
 note: I have the reefing points so would not furl the main around my boom. IP: 142.167.224.116 |
Shortstay
Member
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posted September 16, 2005 12:46 PM
 
You're a fine fellow for providing the "new Ken" with such good shots of the gooseneck!IP: 198.115.167.34 |
whited
unregistered
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posted September 16, 2005 03:26 PM
Thank you...thank you very much!
I noticed that the gooseneck is inserted 90 degrees out of proper alignment.....but the important thing is the 'in' or 'out' mode.
( the old round block in a square hole routine)[This message has been edited by whited (edited September 16, 2005).] IP: 142.167.224.116 |
KenM
Member
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posted September 17, 2005 04:53 PM
Thanks for the additional pictures of the Sandpiper Gooseneck.Anybody have any idea if this changed over the years during production??? Now I have a much better idea about what what i'm dealing with.Looks like a bit of an oddball set up, but having been born in Manchester, England,it lends creedence to the old term, "It's not broken,it's British"Ken M IP: 24.150.50.169 |
whited
unregistered
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posted September 17, 2005 06:29 PM
Mine is a 1986 model...Stan's boat is a few years newer. He may pipe in with his configureation.IP: 142.167.224.116 |
Roger
Member
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posted September 18, 2005 10:37 AM
http://www.dwyermast.com/families.asp?cat1ID=30&cat1Name=Booms Dwyer aluminum has both boom extrusions and the gooseneck fittings to match. I cannot recall the original issue whether it was a missing boom or just a broken gooseneck, but in either case you should be able to get what you need here. First find the type of boom extrusion you have then match it to the gooseneck for that extrusion. If you don't have a boom, match the gooseneck to the sailtrack you have, then match find the boom to match the gooseneck. I note that there are a few goosenecks that appear to be similar to the roller reefing one you describe. Good luck! IP: 216.55.209.75 |
Shortstay
Member
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posted September 18, 2005 01:28 PM
Ken M's hull is the one just before Shortwave, so D'Arcy and/or Ken G should be quite helpful.Hey, Ken M, have you named your girl yet? IP: 198.115.167.36 |
Eric
Member
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posted September 18, 2005 07:09 PM
Yes, good shots Don!
I can tell you all, that sail #144 has the same gooseneck, if it helps any.
FWIW, in my opinion, Ken may not have to go with OEM. If a newer, slightly different gooseneck fitting is available, that will fit the boom and mast slot opening, then I'd go for it.
Good luck in your quest Ken.
Eric IP: 216.209.109.113 |
Ken
Member
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posted September 22, 2005 08:08 AM
ShortWave had the same original gooseneck as pictured here. The narrow tang leading to the ball was cracked. I replaced this gooseneck with a more robust fitting from the parts rack at Genco in Toronto.
Roll reefing was something that they tried in the '70s. The larger boats had a crank to roll te mast.....the sail doesn't retain much shape, the fitting is inherently weak and you can't use your vang. (Some vangs had a cloth part which wrapped up inside the rolled sail)
We installed slab reefing cringles on the sail and found that to be more effective. Remember, it's easier and safer to reef before you go out in brisk winds than reefing out there after you discover you're sailing the boat on it's ear. It's easy to shake out a reef if you've over estimated the windspeed from the shore.------------------
"Never be afraid to try something new: Professionals built the Titanic
And amateurs built the Ark." IP: 141.117.228.250 |
whited
unregistered
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posted September 22, 2005 09:53 AM
Good advice Ken.
Many times we had to deal with our skippers insistence on going full sail on very windy days, only to get overpowered. Then we'd drop the main completely and use the genny.
IP: 142.167.224.116 |
elmet3
Member
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posted September 22, 2005 01:19 PM
Last time I was out on a J105 the skipper wanted to put up the full main and we objected. We won the arguement because the skippers wife was with us and she doesn't like to sail heeled over. We moved along quite well under reefed main, with the skipper grousing about how much faster we would be going with the full main up. Finally we all consented and shook out the reef. We picked up less than 1/2 knot. IP: 67.107.33.106 |
whited
unregistered
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posted September 22, 2005 01:34 PM
I've read that some boats sail faster when level than heeled over. IP: 142.167.224.116 |
Darcy
Member
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posted September 22, 2005 04:00 PM
I think all boats sail faster level than healed. We can sail Shortwave quickly upwind in heavy weather by ragging the main to keep the boat level; but that's hard work letting the sail out then hauling in when the wind softens. A reefed main is much more comfortable sailing.D'Arcy, Shortwave IP: 67.68.51.110 |
Eric
Member
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posted September 22, 2005 09:50 PM
Don, the Sandpiper is one of those boats, that sails better when reefed, in very heavy air!When I had a new main sail made a few years back, I had the sailmaker install reef points for slab reefing. I've slowly added the bits and pieces necessary for "jiffy reefing". It is by far the best way to go, in my opinion. If I'm out and the wind is keeping me on my ear, and I have a way to go, I heave to, and tuck in a reef! Much more relaxing sail, with better speed. Eric IP: 206.172.223.36 |
Darcy
Member
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posted September 23, 2005 09:11 AM
Last night I was racing on a Shark. We had a squall come through just before the race started. The fast boats were the ones that reduced sail. The drove to weather beautifully. We didn't have time to reduce sail. Our skipper did an excellent job of ragging the main and skillful steering. In the gusts however, (which exceeded 30 knots) we were overpowered. The main was out all the way but our large jib still caused us to heal to much and our boatspeed was reduced to a slow crawl. Flat boats sail faster and are much easier to handle. On the run we saw several broahes and death roles. One Int-14 flipped over a wave catapulting the crew well in front of the boat. D'Arcy, Shortwave IP: 67.68.51.110 |
Eric
Member
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posted October 14, 2005 05:05 PM
I had some internet time today, so I thought I'd search around for the elusive gooseneck fitting Ken M requires. Sadly no luck.Apparently Selden bought Gibb Proctor. There wasn't a match at their website, however, Ken may be able to send them a copy of Don's pic above, and see if they have any left or suggestions.
http://www.seldenmast.co.uk/fittings/listing.asp?Category_ID=12 You may also try Rig Rite. at least they're on this side of the Atlantic  Not many pictures, but they list a ton of gooseneck slides. Might have to send them the pic too.
http://www.rigrite.com/A-Main/spar_M.html In my travels, I found the OEM stem head fitting, cleats and chocks for our boats. YS Fittings. They're listed on the HoltAllen website.
http://www.holtallen.com/pdfs/YSCAT2003.pdf Their hardware is so robust, I don't think we'd ever need to change them out  Eric [This message has been edited by Eric (edited October 14, 2005).] IP: 130.63.85.93 |
KenM
Member
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posted October 15, 2005 10:36 PM
Eric,
thanks for your time spent on my behalf............"sadly no luck"is just what I have come up against the past few weeks searching the internet for this gooseneck part.
part # PRS 89-44AWB on Rig-Rites site looks very promising. i've printed out a picture of the gooseneck and will be faxing it to them on Monday....see if we have a match. they list several Proctor Sliding Goosenecks,unfortunately, no pictures!!!
An interesting site I came upon on my travels is as follows. it may interest all.
Take a look at www.ldcracingsailboats.co.uk
They list a whole pile of Proctor parts,boom parts,etc., some of which I recognise as being on my boat,sail#133. Some other parts are obviously updated, but it may be worth your while. They are obviously still available,even if they do come out of the U.K.
Anybody have any idea as to the name/designation of the boom and mast profile? Are they Proctor Masts and Booms???
The print on the label on the foot of my mast looks like it wore off years ago.
thanks to all for continued help ,advise and assistance.
Thinking of naming the boat "Honey Doo". The more I learn,the longer the fix-it list becomes.
KenM
IP: 24.150.50.169 |
Ken
Member
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posted October 17, 2005 08:53 AM
Hi KenM.....call Genco/visit in Toronto...That's where I got my replacement gooseneck fitting. It simply inserts into the existing extrusion on the forward end of the boom.
Better still..when you next visit Toronto.....call/go to the Rigging Shoppe as well. Also try Klaco Spars in Oakville somewhere?Wjhat exactly is the problem with your existing unit? ------------------
"Never be afraid to try something new: Professionals built the Titanic
And amateurs built the Ark." IP: 141.117.228.250 |
SuperPiper
Member
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posted October 17, 2005 09:31 AM
Here is a photo of a gooseneck salvaged from a dinghy (not a Mirror but flying Mirror sails). Since I have changed to a different boom on Sapphire, the boom-end fittings from the original boom are available. The gooseneck from the Mirror may fit the Proctor boom fitting. I will check this weekend. If they match-up, I will send them to you. If you keep them, you will owe me for the shipping charges.
IP: 199.243.115.165 |
KenM
Member
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posted March 24, 2006 10:05 PM
Hello all,
More on the infamous quest for the GOOSENECK.This post goes back to Sept/05, and I think it's worthwhile to revive it.
After spending countless hours on the internet,trips to CL Sailboats,Genco,Fogh Marine,The Rigging Shoppe,(who insisted the part was of Holt-Allen heritage), I finally contacted Rig-Rite again,who had previously said they had the part I required in stock.
2 things stopped me initially from ordering the part from them:
1. I never got to speak to them directly. due to the fire they had last year, i dealt with an answering service, who served as the
go-between between the parties. I did'nt like that.
2. The cost......(US)$189 + $20 shipping.Out of frustration,and a real desire to acquire the gooseneck, i finally broke down and ordered it from them last week,hoping and praying it was the right one. It arrived via courier today, and much to my relief, it is absolutely and positively the one I needed. It is their part # PRS 89 44AWB,as described on their web site. "Gibb Proctor" and "Made in England" stamped on the casting. Many,many thanks go to "Whited" for posting the photos on the forum,as I faxed a printed copy to Rig-Rite to assist them to identify exactly what I was looking for. I believe "Fred" was resposible for the initial provision of the photos posted.......Now I can move on.
In anticipation of the receipt of my newly found part,(still hopefull at that point)I made a trip down to CL Sailboats last Saturday and ordered all new Sheets,Halyards,a new Boom Vang,Topping lift, Main Sheet,Blocks, and, after talking to Tom,an upgraded Keel bearing kit. I'll be picking the order up sometime next week, when everything is in. Now all I need is some decent weather so I can get out and replace my cockpit floor,buff up the hull,clean and paint the interior,install new rub rail, buy an outboard motor, new tires for the trailer,rewire,buy battery,clean sails,re-epoxy rudder,rebuild motor mount plywood,repair rotted wood in locker bulkheads, and I think I'm ready to go sailing!!!!!!!!!
As mentioned in a prior post, the name "Honey Doo" for the boat is becoming more and more favoured as time goes on. IP: 24.36.81.245 |
whited
unregistered
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posted March 25, 2006 12:13 AM
Glad to help.Wow..$210.00 for that part...I'll baby mine
this summer. IP: 142.167.245.101 |
KenM
Member
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posted March 25, 2006 12:40 AM
For the information of all,
CL sailboats were still telling me they have a fix coming for the gooseneck problem, but that the machine shop is still too busy. 6 months later, i'm told the same thing.
I stuck my neck out,and I got what I was looking for. I just couldn't wait any longer.
No disrespect meant or implied to the good folks at CL. They care about what they do.
IP: 24.36.81.245 |
whited
unregistered
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posted March 25, 2006 10:20 AM
KenM...What will you go with on an outboard?
I guess you'll want a 6hp or maybe an 8 with a charging system for your battery.
For me, the big question (besides what brand) would be 2 stroke or 4 stroke.
If I thought I'd be doing a lot of motoring, I'd choose the 4 stroke, but if my home waters only required me to flash the outboard up getting in and out of a dock...a 2 would probably do. Have you decided?
IP: 142.167.245.101 |
KenM
Member
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posted March 25, 2006 11:38 AM
Not decided yet, but from what I've read on the forums, it would appear a 6 HP, 4 stroke is the best way to go. In the main I'll be sailing Lake Erie around the Port Colborne area. It gets very windy in those parts, so I'm very reluctant to go down to a 2 HP. I've read that size motor in heavy winds really doesn't do much.
still trying to get over the cost of these things, even the used ones. IP: 24.36.81.245 |
whited
unregistered
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posted March 25, 2006 12:27 PM
I meant 2 stroke...rather than 2 hp.
I wouldn't use a 2 hp on anything larger than a CL 16
Now..my British Seagull 3 hp Forty Plus would probably move the Sandpiper around pretty good...if you could stand the noise and stink.IP: 142.167.245.101 |
Hyprstitch
Member
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posted March 25, 2006 06:40 PM
I usually run a Suzuki 4hp 4 stroke. But I have a 2.2 Honda 4 stroke that does well. Only reason I went to the bigger motor is the Honda had no neutral or reverse.Sid IP: 64.12.116.7 |
KenM
Member
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posted March 25, 2006 07:53 PM
I knew you meant 2 stroke........I mentioned 2 HP, as that is what CL recommends as an outboard motor rating in their manual for the Sandpiper.IP: 24.36.81.245 |
whited
unregistered
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posted March 25, 2006 08:32 PM
I have what appear to be the original rigging manual and the original brocure for the Sandpiper.
Both say..when discussing the outboard motor bracket...
"(7 1/2 h.p. max. long shaft recommended)"
This can be found at the bottom of page 1 of the rigging manual and near the top of page 4 of the brocure.IP: 142.167.245.101 |
Windroos
Member
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posted March 25, 2006 11:25 PM
If I can be of any help.In 1984 I had a 7.5 hp Mercyry 2 stroke that ran well. In 2002 till 2004 I used a 6hp Mercury 2 stroke. 2005 I bought a Yamaha 4 stroke 6 hp (same blcok as the 8) The weight is up 20 pound+. I changed my bracket for a much sturdy one. I do not regret a moment the change to the 4 stroke as I get less pollution and a very high milleage. I have a battery charger in the motor and the cranking is much easier. Would not return to 2 stroke. Don't forget, the weight is there and I added a metal plate in the lazarette so the wooden part inside the transom would not suffur too much for the added weight. The power is there too and in the St Lawrence river with a 3 to 5 knot current, I need it. Bye ------------------
John
Quebec city
1981 Sandpiper 927 IP: 66.131.165.49 |
whited
unregistered
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posted March 26, 2006 09:38 AM
Yes, the size motor required has a lot to do with the waters you sail.
On a big open lake like Ontario, Huron etc...
or on the open ocean where I sail, the wind can travel hundreds..if not a thousand miles without touching land. (fetch)
If you are on the receiving end of the wind/waver or swells, it can be a bit unnerving. On the other hand, if you sail on a nice smaller lake where you can see all shores and you sail on pleasant days...that nice little Yamaha F2.5 hp sure looks good. http://www.yamaha-motor.ca/products/products.php?model=1933&class=28&group=O|&LANG=en IP: 142.167.245.101 |
KenM
Member
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posted March 26, 2006 10:45 AM
I guess i goofed, not once, but twice on this motor HP issue.
My manual makes no mention of recommended HP. (It's the one downloaded from GRYC off the internet).A different manual is out there??
My reference to 2HP is from a post by Cody in Jan/02,and talks about auxilliary power rating for a CL 16, not a Sandpiper!!!
My mistake. In an attempt to learn as much as I can about my boat before I throw her in the water I have been reading through countless forum posts through the winter.It's all good stuff, and I must have got confused.
Not knowing anything much about outboards, i do know I want Forward/Nuetral/Reverse on the motor.Not sure where i need to go engine wise in order to get this option. I figured that out like this:- Being a newbie to sailing, i would not be too crazy about bashing into a dock, or worse yet, someone else's boat, due to lack of experience on my part.I need to do more research,or seek more advise. I'm sure I'll get some more info. from the forum members.....please!!, and I look forward to that.
KenM
IP: 24.36.81.245 |
Windroos
Member
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posted March 26, 2006 06:15 PM
Hi ken,It depends on where you use your sailboat. Here in Quebec, the current is very strong and the wind too. So 6 hp 4 stroke it's the minimal for me. Fow, rev and neutral are essential in close space. It's nice to be able to have full control of your boat. Furthermore, if you plan in kipping it for a while, it is a good investment. I have own Sandpiper since 1982 and I must say that I need to feel safe returning home. My girlfriend would not appreciate it otherwise.
------------------
John
Quebec city
1981 Sandpiper 927 IP: 66.131.165.49 |
Darcy
Member
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posted March 26, 2006 06:30 PM
We've got an 8 hp. It's a bit of overkill for our lake but there have been times where the extra power has been welcomed. Pulling up anchor in a line squall is strenuous but the motor was strong enough to move the boat into the wind.Unless you're racing in a real competative one-design fleet wher every ounce of weight is critical, I'd error to the more powerful side. D'Arcy, Shortwave IP: 65.92.115.207 |
Eric
Member
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posted May 01, 2006 12:28 PM
Ken, I had a good look at my gooseneck today, to see how the fitting attached to the boom. Remember when I was over, we weren't sure how it "stays put".
It looks as though you'll have to remove the end cap from the boom. There is a washer of good size, slid over the squre shaft part, and a cotter pin drilled through the end of the square shaft, preventing the washer from coming off. The washer also holds the square shaft in the casting. Once the pin and washer are secure, you can reinstall the casting piece back onto the boom.
Hope this helps.
EricIP: 130.63.85.93 |
KenM
Member
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posted May 01, 2006 04:32 PM
Thanks Eric,
I'll be sure to do that.Ken
IP: 24.36.81.245 | |
